Aug 10, 2020Liked by Jordan Schachtel

A great read.

I'm having trouble convincing people why NZ is really a bad outcome, they don't care about the cost of its policy, even if it was to save 2400 mostly elderly and sick people from dying.

The money they would save by not becoming an isolated prison island would save many more if invested in health budgets.

But when the virus breaks loose in New Zealand, this will all have been clearly for nothing, and a big double failure.

At this point it will be safe to say New Zealand is the worst failure of them all.

They are hanging by a thread.

I wonder if they realise this as well.

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Aug 11, 2020Liked by Jordan Schachtel

Some of us do...unfortunately Jacinda Adern is a Saint to most NewZealanders. They would rather die of hunger than Covid

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These old sick people are still going to die, sadly.

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If you catch Covid19 your chance of dying from it is the same as your chance of dying from any health-related cause over the next 12 months. This is true regardless of your age.

It mostly kills people in nursing homes because they have a 50% chance of dying every year basically. The life expectancy of people entering the Swedish nursing homes reportedly ravaged by Covid19 was 9 months.

Anything would kill these people, or nothing. They could just lie in their rooms and catch nothing at all and they would still die within a year.

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Then why not let them die without savaging the economy (which will kill even more people, BTW)?

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Yes that was my point

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I was telling people in April that we would have a big initial peak and then be OK and then have another lockdown in September. I was a little off on the timing but you only have to read Knut Whitkowski's March/April paper to see that a second wave always comes and that second wave is bigger when you have a lockdown in the first wave. I trust that science, not rat face Fauci's BS. There is no evidence that it is possible to "eradicate" these viruses. Nobody has done it before. NZ failed. It was pointless to try. Jacinda screwed up the country for nothing.

Too much locking down and all you do is keep the virus healthy and thriving, and provide a susceptible population for more and more peaks. That's all you achieve. Jacinda has flattened what would normally be a 6-8 week outbreak into a 3 year (I estimate) nightmare. More people are dying of suicide from the lockdowns than of the virus.

As soon as we open up, all those old people will die of the flu or the common cold anyway. It's absolutely a hoax.

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One of the really devastating things which is happening to New Zealanders as a result of the government's policies is the separation of members of the Kiwi diaspora from their families back home. This is causing enormous distress, particularly when a family member falls ill or dies. Closing the borders has resulted in fewer and fewer flights coming and going from New Zealand, leading to difficulties coming or going from the country and very high fares. This combined with mandatory quarantine for 2 weeks (now having to be paid by those who the government incarcerates in managed isolation facilities) exacerbates the distress. The nationalistic fervour whipped up by the "Team of 5 Million" rhetoric has been incredibly divisive, with New Zealanders returning home being at the receiving end of downright nastiness by their fellow citizens. It's all a bloody nightmare.

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This is what happens when emotion runs a country.

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yes, they avoided covid, the cost, the stress, the sickness, the deaths and the chaos. they may become somewhat poorer in some ways but if they are open internally they can go to school, open restaurants and have all kinds of national and internal work and business. when it's at 0 they don't have to wear masks. they can go back to work. they just need to be vigilent and let the experts ponder the situation.

the new zealanders can be self sufficient and if not they will become self sufficient which is not a bad thing. they generate electricity because they are more sustainably based then most countries and they can grow enough food for everyone. it doesn't seem like that guy who wrote the article above should worry so much about new zealand. they can weather the siege. he should be more concerned about his own home.

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Well Julian.. We had 3 months of "freedom" indeed.

Where everything is back to normal internally (if you ignore the economic devastation for some) except the borders are cut off from the rest of humanity...

And I was extremely happy not to have to wear masks, unfortunately this is slowly and surely coming here now, which is very sad to see..

But imagine the toll on people's spirit when you tell them after 3 months, that they'll have to go into lockdown again...

And imagine that the virus is eliminated a second time.. And that it re-emerges again a few months later... What would be achieved if we had to go into a 3rd lockdown ? and then a 4th, a 5th ?

The best that could happen to New Zealand now, is for the politician to lose control and for this virus to spread widely into the communities so we can finally have our "first wave" of infection and after that be like other countries and start moving forward and not backward !

But be reassured that most New Zealanders do not share my opinion and will be blindly following the commands of their political elite, even if it means jumping off a bridge..

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thanks good to hear your point of view. i live in hawaii and it is going thru the same thing. here we have had the lowest numbers in the US 0 on a number of occasions. we would open internally then people (usually flight attendants or pilots) would bring in covid and we would slowly close down once again to wipe it out.

here you have the hawaiian population and they all have the memory of millions of hawaiians dying from when whitemen brought diseases they had no immunity for. huge swaths of their community wipe out. their were happy in their social isolation prior to that. they have no reason to want to have that again even on a smaller level.

the island depends on tourism and of course oil (still) and food come from elsewhere. herd immunity and even just immunity is a question. my opinion/thinking is go for self sufficiency. everyone has wanted it for a long time. go for sustainability. live closer to the land and not so harshly upon nature. someone has to do it. :-)

i lived on the mainland US and now i see the zaniness going on there now where 5 million have been infected over 5 months. lots of people have never obeyed any of the rules. with a population of 330 million it's going to be a loooong time till they have herd immunity of 70-90% of the population. hospitals will continue to be overloaded, lots of people of all ages will die, many will have continuing health problems.

for me both options of shutting down and opening up are not very attractive. but by far i would choosen shutting down and everyone following the rules till covid is totally stamped out which could have happened in 3 weeks and we would have been done with it. going the herd immunity direction seems crazy to me.

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>till covid is totally stamped out which could have happened in 3 weeks and we would have been done with it.

We really must work on those reading skills of yours:


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Next season it will be ignored and called a cold, which literally is all the best pathologists in the world are finding, no new pathogens, nothing but a cold. In fact it was declared ''novel'' by WHO after only 41 cases and 3 autopsies in Wuhan.

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The Atlantic is a reliable propaganda source for sure.

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You really, really need to learn how to read critically, and not think you can dismiss arguments by demeaning their source (which isn't the actual source of the science anyway, Einstein):


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You sir, are a fool.

If they did absolutely nothing they wouldn't have even noticed Covid. That is a FACT. You might think you are "thinking" but you are not. You have no idea what you are talking about.

Respiratory viruses cannot be "stamped out". Where did you get this notion? I know: you just made it up, based on the wisdom gleaned from watching TV. What a productive thought process.

Maybe instead of that idiotic method you should read papers by actual epidemiologists that don't lie like Fauci.

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Absolute BS. They will say we need to remain vigilant for years now. If you fly in they will only process one plane at a time even at the country's largest airport. From that plane they will take 20 people at a time. You sit and wait. Another 20 will be taken through customs once the first 20 have been delivered by bus to their quarantine hotel. And on it goes. It is absolute madness for a virus that is like a mild flu in most cases.

There is no end in sight because of this. We have two choices according to Ardern: remain pure and holy with infinite lockdowns or die like flies. She is an evil woman I believe. I think she had something to do with the CHCH false flag patsy operation too in order to disarm us.

Because we were not allowed to gain herd immunity they can threaten us with the virus in perpetuity. Who is this Bloomfield character? There are plenty of experts saying he is wrong, but he and Ardern just ignore them all and do what they want.

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I used to think the Brits were the most obnoxious, self absorbed, arrogant jerks of the English speaking world.

Then I visited New Zealand.

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Lol, what part of New Zealand have you visited ? xD

I have been living in NZ for 6 years, kiwis are very friendly people.

They trust their political class too much however and sometimes have a hard time telling you frankly that they are not happy about something you've done (eg. have a hard time telling you that you are doing a bad job at work)..

Also they don't know how to build insulated houses, but nobody is perfect, I like kiwi people more than my countrymen

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Really stupid. They are just putting off the inevitable. The whole world has lost their minds except Sweden.

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Sweden's doomed for other reasons.

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Complete and utter insanity for nothing more than a strong dose of the seasonal flu.

It's too bad you Kiwis gave up your only real mode of self defense against the tyranny your government is raining down on you.

Good luck on what she decides is "Best for you" in the future.

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As at 11/8/20, just over 5 million cases in the US with just over 162,000 deaths. Where are you getting deaths of 500 per million. In New Zealand we have a pop of roughly 5 million, which means likely deaths may be around the same if everyone got it. That's the population of Hamilton, our 4th largest city. Are you willing for us to sacrifice that many lives, as well as the nonlethal but serious negative impacts such as lung and heart damage for hundreds of thousands more?

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Mitchell, we can clearly see the numbers of people dying from Covid..

But what we do not see are the numbers of people dying from suicide, domestic violence or the numerous economic and psychological consequences of lockdowns.

At some point, we have to ask ourselves, what would be best for society..

Having 2, 3, 4, 5 lockdowns and potentially preventing some people from dying from Covid ?

Or completely destroying the fabric of society and having an unknown number of deaths due to economic and societal collapse ?

But what certain is that, when the consequences of lockdown number 3, 4 or 5 will be obvious to everyone, the lockdowns will cease even if the virus is still around.. and it would have been all for nothing.

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Most are not dying from the virus, they are dying from the conditions that were already killing them, in Australia we claim that people with end of life alzheimers patients over 100 are dying from the virus.

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Median age of Coronavirus death in Australia is 84.

People like that die of anything, or even nothing. The doctors scratch their heads when writing the death certificates and just list everything they had or might have had. If they tested positive for covid, that goes on the list too along with 20 other things.

Then they get listed as a COVID19 death in the government statistics.

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People as dumb as you should not be allowed to comment on dangerous things.

A "case" is someone who needs treatment. A "positive test" is just that. They are different. The media conflates the two.

The actual death rate is something like 0.07% for this virus. Forget your retarded numbers. Just forget them.

Stupid people like you will be the death of us all.

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Let it rip NZ. It'll all be over in a month and yas can start clawing back 10 years of lost value. Also do you do lynchings?

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I'm in NZ.

It's very stupid (or evil) what they are doing.

Scientists here, Israel, Germany, and elsewhere are saying that if we weren't told about this virus "we wouldn't have even noticed it". That is true, but try telling it to the people that watch TV and are susceptible to Jacindamania. They cannot understand how this could be true. They simply lack the intelligence unfortunately.

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I am a lockdown-skeptic New Zealander and have read many articles like yours touting the Swedish strategy as successful. However in New Zealand Sweden's infection and mortality rates are being compared to those of Norway, Denmark and Finland, which you will be aware are substantially lower, to prove lockdown is the better strategy. I am aware that Norway has concluded they should not have locked down to the extent they did but are you able to give some explanation for why all three countries appear to have escaped so lightly vis a vis Sweden. Thank you.

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The difference lies in the care homes. In Sweden the care homes are much larger than Norway, so more people susceptible to the virus. Norway did a better job protecting their care homes so this is why the deaths are lower. One important thing to note about the deaths in Sweden is that their death rate is 100.000 per year normally. The deaths from coronavirus are in the age group that normally dies, the 80s. Of the 6,000 that died almost 2 3rds are in that category, so it's not true to say that coronavirus killed them because they were already in their last days. The rest are spread out in the ages 70 and 60, very very few In the younger categories. In terms of overall mortality Sweden has not seen excess deaths that are higher than previous years. To say that coronavirus has been devastating for Sweden is a lie. The most important thing to realise is the lie that is being sold, that deaths can be prevented with lockdown. Lockdown was imposed for 1 reason only: to prevent the medical system from being overwhelmed by spreading out the infections. There were always going to be cases and deaths. The narrative was changed however when it became painfully obvious that the models were wrong, then it became the strategy to eliminate the virus in the absence of a vaccine, something that cannot be done and is utterly unrealistic. Dont fall into the trap of arguing this from the set narrative of the media.

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Yes Jacinda Ardern told us the lockdown was to "flatten the curve". They were going to slow down initial hospitalizations but basically let it rip until it was over.

She lied. They shut the hospitals almost completely and they were nearly empty.

Do you understand, sheep? She LIED!

Nurses I know said the hospital wards were almost completely empty for months. We should have isolated rest homes for 2 months, and just let the virus go like we did for all other CV outbreaks. Nobody worried about coronaviruses before.

Ferguson's data from the UK was all lies and BS. The NZ govt used that data and appears to be still using it. He's the same guy that said Swine Flu would kill 50 million people and it killed 150. So why is that clown's data still trusted? I suspect it wasn't trusted but they used it anyway.

They are in on Fauci's conspiracy obviously. Nobody could possibly be this stupid.

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All this brainless hysteria was based on the Neil Ferguson fake maths model claiming up to 60% of populations would get the virus.

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The fact is there was no need for any of it, this so called new coronavirus has never existed, not a single study or autopsy has ever found any new pathogen.

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Another NZ sheep.

They compare Sweden to Norway because Norway is more sparsely populated. They should compare Sweden to certain US states or the UK. Then Sweden looks great.

People like you really need to stop commenting. I've read scientific papers on this virus, and spoken in person to dissenting epidemiologists so I have the basis to form a better opinion than people like you that just watch TV.

Stop spreading misinformation. Millions of people will eventually die because of lockdown Nazis like you. They are already dying by the hundreds of thousands due to these lockdowns actually.

BTW, Norway hasn't escaped yet. None of us have. Except Sweden of course.

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And when you need a new virus, Covid shows up, again!

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No answer Jordan? I guess your silence says it all...

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Hey Jordan, exactly what is your journalistic background?

And can you answer under your own name, instead of the aliases you use?

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Slight syntax error in the last sentence [sry] but an excellent, no bullshit article.

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At least there is less chance for China to infiltrate them with Spies the way they are infiltrating the US, Canada, Australia, the EU and the ROW. If they end up tanking the tourist industry for a while, the task is just to develop other industries. Tourism is very over-rated in that part of the world anyway. New Zealand has good universities, a well-educated workforce, adequate capital structure and could just invest assets in more high-tech industries.

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